Mingo Creek County Park, PA

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#1)  Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby sjhalow » Fri Apr 23, 2010 7:58 pm

Ents,

A few weeks ago I reported on some tree measuring at Mingo Creek County Park in Washington County PA.
Since then, I've made over a dozen trips to the park in an effort to do a reasonably detailed survey of the trees.
The park is about 2600 acres in size, probably 60% of which is forested.
Consequently, this project has required a great deal of hiking and scrambling along steep hillsides and rocky streams.
Though arduous, the effort has been very rewarding and informative to me.

From the very beginning I was surprised to find how context dependent my sense of tree height is.
Larger caliber trees on level terrain were almost invariably shorter than thinner trees along steep hillside and in coves.
Even though I already knew this intellectually, my perception of height kept colliding the reality displayed by my Nikon 550.
As I've gained more experience, my perception has improved... somewhat.

The woodlands of the park are textbook mixed mesophytic forest.
About 15 native tree species are commonly found in the forest canopy.
At least 15 additional native species occur ocasionally.
The trees in the park are virtually all secondary if not tertiary growth.
With the exception of a few scatterd old field trees, I would guess they are generally 50 to 100 years old.

Mingo Creek runs from west to east though the center of the park.
The stream bank and flood plain is home to many tall sycamore trees.
They also occur occasionally on the slopes and along feeder streams, north and south of the main stem.

               
                       
MingoGazeboSycamores.JPG
                       
The sycamores around this gazebo range from 126 to 134' high
               
               


               
                       
MingoHollowSycamoreA.JPG
                       
Here's an old hollow sycamore. I measured a cbh of 21'-4" and even though it's declining, got a height measurement > 100'
               
               

 
In the southwest corner of the park I found a couple dozen decent tulip trees. The tallest is just shy of 130'.
These are relatively young trees, so hopefully that they will grow to be considerable taller.
Downwind and from these trees,a 2 or 3 acre abandoned field, has been transformed almost pure stand of young tulip poplars.
Some are already around 90' high.

Another pioneer species, Black Cherry, is ubiquitous through out the park.
Most are between 90 and 110' in height, but competition with oak, hickory and ash, has pushed some a bit higher.
I found a few in the 120's.
               
                       
MingoBlackCherry.JPG
                       
Black Cherry - 128'
               
               


Sassafras is found along borders and mixed in with young stands of maple and black cherry.
Where the forest is more mature, I occasionally found the dead trunks of overtopped sassafras.
But a few are still hanging on here and there.
               
                       
MingoSassafras.JPG
                       
100'+ sassafras growing between 2 oak trees
               
               


               
                       
MingoWhiteAsh.JPG
                       
An old White Ash with nice root character
               
               


This is the Henry family farmhouse.
               
                       
MingoHenryHouseB.JPG
                                       
               

They were early homesteaders in the area.
               
                       
MingoHenryHouseA.JPG
                                       
               

The house was built in 1817, perhaps the Sugar Maples growing around it were planted at the same time.

I got a surprisingly good RI of 122.6' for the park. Much better than I expected.
               
                       
MingoTreeHeights.jpg
                                       
               

The park's steeply sloped topography and good species diversity substantially boosted the number.
I am anxious to survey some other sites in the area to see how they compare.

A list of the 12 x 100 trees. There are a few more that I haven't measured yet.
               
                       
Mingo12x100s.jpg
                                               
Mingo12x100s.jpg (66.09 KiB) Viewed 1306 times
               
               

4 of the NROs, including the 2 biggest, are found in a 4-5 acre grove of old oak trees in the NE corner of the park.

Other trees found but not yet measured

Black Gum
Black Locust
Honey Locust
Osage Orange
American Basswood
Shellbark Hickory
Chestnut Oak
Black Willow
Colorado Blue Spruce
Bigtooth Aspen
Austrian Pine
Slippery Elm


This project has really challenged my tree identification skills. So its possible I that missed a few things.
I am particularly weak with elm trees, any helpful hints would be appreciated.
I hope to resurvey the park in a few years and see how things have changed.

Best regards,

Steve Halow

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#2)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park

Postby edfrank » Fri Apr 23, 2010 8:17 pm

Steve,

You wrote:
my perception of height kept colliding the reality displayed by my Nikon 550


A very nice turn of phrase.  I enjoyed your account very much.  It sounds like a neat place. Excellent photos as well.  It seems like you have the measurement process down fairly well.  You still, even when experieinced need to adjust your height perceptions of the trees after you have taken the first few shots.  We tend to see trees as tall relative to other trees in the area, rather than as the more abstract concpet of actual height.  

I would encourage you to try to get girths for as many trees as possible when you measure heights, especially for the tallest trees used for the Rucker Index.  I want to also encourage people to measure crown spread and to get GPS cooridinates for the outstandin trees.  However, I find myself also lacking when it comes to measuring crown spreads, and I try to tell  myself to do better the next time.  I am pretty good at getting GPS coordinates for outstanding trees.  

I look forward to more accounts of the park and other sites nearby.

Ed Frank
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#3)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby James Parton » Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:22 pm

Steve,

Very nice report. It would take me some time to get all these measurements done. Nice rucker too!

James
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#4)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby dbhguru » Sat Apr 24, 2010 8:39 am

Steve,

  I echo the sentiments of the others. Outstanding report! Chalk up another for the Pennsylvania team. You all in the Keystone State are so far ahead of the rest of us in terms of the number of sites you've measured that you could take a year-long vacation from measuring and still remain ahead of us all-so-rans.

  In terms of judging tree height in the field, it is both an art and a science, but with the emphasis on art. There are many factors that enter the picture including tree shape and even tree color to an extent. Certainly the proximity of nearby objects to use for scaling is helpful, but even when objects are present, big errors can be made - by experienced people. Your post has inspired me to write an essay on the physical and psychological aspects of judging tree size. We in ENTS have plenty to say on the topic, if anyone does. As an example, I just communicated with a retired forester from Virginia who had been measuring and dating downed trees on the Montpelier Estate  north of Charlottesville, VA. The best he could get for a prostrate tuliptree was 135 feet. Of course it was broken up, but he had attempted to reconstruct it. Gaines McMartin explains that you can't reconstruct the original heights of fallen tuliptrees, so the poor fellow was doomed to fall short, I guess. But he didn't express awareness of the magnitude of the challenge in our conversation. However, this is not  a criticism. The fellow is highly knowledgeable about the tree species in the area, where they grow best, etc. I could tell that he has extensive knowledge of the trees in the area and he is personable and easy to talk to. However, I doubt that he believed the heights I was measuring for the tulips on Montpelier are even possible. He has no experience with lasers, and is well aware of the challenge of measuring broad-crowned hardwoods on sloping ground and in close proximity to one another. He doesn't even try, which speaks well for him.

  If forestry professionals with decades of experience can't accurately estimate tree height under forest conditions, then it must be a more highly specialized skill than we have realized. The forester walked by at least 15 standing tulips in the area over 150 feet in height and easily that many between 140 and 150 and he missed recognizing their exceptional stature - every last tree. So, it is time that we in ENTS turn our attention to the task of describing our estimating skills to others, which means we have to figure out what it is that we do. BTW, folks like Will Blozan often estimate tree height to within a foot. I'm always impressed with Will's eye What does Will see? What is he using for comparison purposes? I'm pretty good, but not that good. I'll recognize a new candidate for the 150 Club in Mohawk, but I can misjudge by as much as 10 feet, sometimes more. I won't misjudge by 30 feet, which routinely happens for folks without an practiced eye. Sometimes they miss by 50 or 60 feet.
  Well, enough on the subject at this point. Stay tuned. Again, thanks for the excellent post. And a big salute to the Pennsylvania team.

Bob
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#5)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby James Parton » Sat Apr 24, 2010 10:23 am

Bob,

We down here in North Carolina have gotta get on the ball. Will Blozan has some unposted stuff and then we have Michael Davie, Josh Kelly and Myself. You Massachusetts folks could not be far behind Pennsylvania either. Hey, we gotta peaceful little war going on here. There's nothing wrong with a little competition. We're gonna get you Steve, Ed & the A-Team!

James
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#6)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby sjhalow » Sun Apr 25, 2010 12:33 am

Thanks everyone for the feedback and encouragement.
I've been mainly focused on heights over the last for weeks, and apologize for neglecting cbh measurements at times.
I did obtain GPS coordinates and intend to go back for circumference info later. This is no hardship for me, as the park is along my route to and from work.

It seems to me the problem with estimating tree height is three-fold. The first problem is bad information. When I was a kid, I recall reading field guides that left me with the general impression that most eastern trees typically range from 70 to 100 feet in height. The exceptions being White Pine, Tulip Poplar and Sycamore. I spent the next 30+ years hiking through forest, looking at trees and confidently assessing their heights within this range. When I got the Nikon 550, the scales fell off my eyes and this misconception went out the window. It is really just a scaling issue and once I started to trust the instrument, was easily rectified. Still I think it is worthwhile project to produce new field guides with more accurate information.

The second problem is a more insidious matter of perspective. Simply put, from ground level, the bottom 10' of a tree has a much greater visual impact than the top 10'. I think this can mostly be overcome with experience, but human beings are not naturally good at this.

The third and most troubling issue is context.  A tree in a park or towering over much smaller trees seems monumental, whereas a tall tree in a forest of tall trees can be perceived as merely ordinary. The context issue is especially problematic with tree heights because it is compounded by the perspective issue. However, I've also noticed it with circumference. Fortunately tree circumference is a more human scale dimension, and being near the ground isn't distorted by distance or angle.
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#7)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby dbhguru » Sun Apr 25, 2010 8:44 am

Steve,

    You've made a very good assessment of the factors that influence perception of tee height. Another is viewing angle. People may unconsciously adjust their viewing angle when walking in the woods to avoid neck strain. They get closer to shorter trees and judge them to be taller than they actually are. Knowing what the foliage of a favorite species looks like in the crown as viewed from a horizontal distance of say 50 yards allows one to quickly recognize a new height candidate.

Bob
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#8)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby Don » Sun Apr 25, 2010 6:31 pm

Enough practice makes nearly perfect!
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#9)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby edfrank » Sun Apr 25, 2010 7:00 pm

Don,

No practice doesn't make perfect, but it does make you better sometimes.  Look at Charles Barkley's golf swing.  It is just that some of us are born perfect. and the rest of you are jealous.

Ed
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#10)  Re: Mingo Creek County Park, PA

Postby Don » Sun Apr 25, 2010 7:20 pm

Ed-
Point taken! Michael Jordan won't let Charles play in his Tournament...
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