Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

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MarkGraham
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by MarkGraham » Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:05 pm

I will email you GE overlay file. When loading into GE select open vs import. Then the color height map is yellow over 100, orange over 125, and red over 150 (but didn't note any red).

If I missed an area let me know and I will download and run the 2008 LiDAR. To do this I use NOAA Elevation Data and ArcGIS Pro. I don't know how to use GE itself to estimate tree height. Some people try using tree shadows or if the area has 3D trees add an opaque rectangle and position it a certain height above ground. This works ok in flat areas.

MarkGraham
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by MarkGraham » Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:05 pm

Here's the entire area for which I downloaded and ran the LiDAR. Green is over 75 feet, yellow over 100 feet, and orange over 125 feet.
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woodwardpalarge.JPG

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:41 pm

Hi Mark,
Thanks for making the LiDAR map and telling me how to make it. Yeah, I believe most of the Pines and Hemlocks have sadly been logged within the past few years.
If I may ask, where do you get the GE overlay? And then you can put it in google earth? In Pennsylvania, PASDA provides LiDAR in a few formats, like LAS, and others.
Also, if you are wanting to, can you help me with using LiDAR for a few other locations I have been wondering about in South-Eastern PA? I don't have a 2-point measurer, so it will be interesting to know the approximate height of some of the trees in a few old-growth groves I have found.

MarkGraham
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by MarkGraham » Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:38 am

I created the GE overlay from ArcGIS, using the color height map I created in ArcGIS from the circa 2008 LAS point cloud file available on NOAA elevation data.

Sure, I can run LiDAR for a couple other locations. Let me know the approximate GPS coordinates and the size of the grove.

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:59 am

Hi Mark,
Yeah, I am having lots of trouble trying to do it. I'm on: https://www.arcgis.com/home/webmap/viewer.html?useExisting=1 , but I cant import a LAS overlay LiDAR file from PA. It says its too large, and I need to pay money to do it. I really wish I could do it though.
Anyway, thanks for the help with creating the LiDAR for some locations. For now, one location I have really been wanting to get tested was Stateline Woods Preserve, on 814 Merrybell Ln, Kennett Square, PA 19348. The park is about 82 acres, and if you could try to do a LiDAR for roughly the whole park, it would be great to see.
Here's the coordinates of the old-growth in the park: 39.820781, -75.674274 Its roughly in the middle of the forest.
Here's a photo of the park boundaries:
StatelineWoodsPreserveMAP.PNG
Thanks very much, and let me know if you need any more info/coordinates for the LiDAR.
BeeEnvironment

MarkGraham
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by MarkGraham » Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:01 pm

Attached is 2007 LiDAR color height map for Stateline area. Looking at GE which has 2019 photo, all the trees are still there.

Red is over 150, orange over 125, yellow over 100. There are several areas with trees over 150, with tallest LiDAR indicated height in 2007 of 159 feet.

For tree height, if do a Google search on "using arcgis to find tree height" there is some arcgis documentation returned. But then as you point out the main issue is to run these big point clouds a license is needed. If you are using arcgis just for yourself and not as part of a network, arcgis has a personal use desktop license which is about $100 per year.
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stateline pa.JPG

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:02 am

Thanks very much Mark
Its fascinating to know now the approximate tree heights for the area! Thankfully, the large forest on the left hand side is the nearby Marshall Millhouse Preserve, so it is public land available to the public. However, I could never had guessed that on the right side, towards center, it seems like one tree is pretty tall! Its hard to tell if it is on private property or park land though. It may happen to be very close to the border of the park.
I found a website that offers Canopy-Height Models for free, but the catch is that it is currently only open to academic students with a .edu email. However, some areas that have coverage due to flood measures have it available. Here is the website: https://opentopography.org/ , though now I cant seem to open a Tar.GZ file that has canopy heights. It is pretty frustrating.
Thanks again anyhow! I will be sure to save the LiDAR image above you provided so I can always refer to it in the future.
BeeEnvironment
P.S-If it's alright with you, and your able to handle it of course, is it okay If I privately message you on ENTS a few more locations to be processed with LiDAR??

MarkGraham
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by MarkGraham » Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:31 pm

Yes that is fine. Good that big forest to the west is protected.

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BeeEnvironment2020
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Re: Undiscovered Old-Growth near Woodward PA??

Post by BeeEnvironment2020 » Fri Jan 15, 2021 9:49 am

Thanks. I just sent an private message to you in ENTS.
Yes, the forest to the west is protected. Most of it seems 2nd growth, with some OG on the higher slopes and survivors scattered throughout. Ive been there once before, and the trees can get quite large (especially the Oak and Beech).

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