General Sherman is NOT single stem origin. Hence, not the ..

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mdvaden
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Re: General Sherman is NOT single stem origin. Hence, not th

Post by mdvaden » Tue Apr 10, 2018 10:25 am

Here' s an older photo of a landscape redwood in Beaverton, Oregon, where I used to live and work. This man's tree is about 50 years old. I included the upward view because it shows a gap between. Although some tree stems may bend apart some, the small of a gap is no obstacle for a redwood to expand and merge. Seeing how wide the base grew in 5 decades, it's certain the tree could fill the overhead void with wood growth in another 50 years.

At times, the upward view can give the impression of stems bending apart, when it may just look that way because the diameter of both sides tapers more narrow.

In nature, multiple stems can enlarged up to 4 feet thick, 6 feet thick or more. Two double stems can easily fill an 8 foot void from a combined 4 feet expansion from each side. Cell elongation is mostly in the upper few feet and inches of a redwood tree, so once the trunks have grown up leaving a gap, that gap starts decreasing every year, with some exceptions like forcing from storm damage and other falling trees or major limbs.
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Redwood_600_Beaverton2.jpg
Redwood_600_Beaverton.jpg
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Don
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Re: General Sherman is NOT single stem origin. Hence, not th

Post by Don » Wed Apr 11, 2018 1:36 am

I had the good fortune to have a day free to wander up into the Sierra Nevadas and hike around the Trail of 100 Giants at about 6000'.
Some of those Giant Sequoias seemed to show a propensity to grow together into two stems, and over time even three stems.
I thought I'd include a couple, that might further fuel our discussion.
It's just as interesting to 'twig' out how these trees got to where they are, as it is to predict what they might look like 250 years from now,
500 years from now, or 1000 years from now. What say you ?
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and,
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Don Bertolette - President/Moderator, WNTS BBS
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mdvaden
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Re: General Sherman is NOT single stem origin. Hence, not th

Post by mdvaden » Thu Apr 12, 2018 12:53 am

Don wrote:I had the good fortune to have a day free to wander up into the Sierra Nevadas and hike around the Trail of 100 Giants at about 6000'.
Some of those Giant Sequoias seemed to show a propensity to grow together into two stems, and over time even three stems.
I thought I'd include a couple, that might further fuel our discussion.
It's just as interesting to 'twig' out how these trees got to where they are, as it is to predict what they might look like 250 years from now,
500 years from now, or 1000 years from now. What say you ?
Provided the trees don't rip apart and just grow. a lot of the air gaps between can begin to vanish. The cell elongation zone is near the very top of the tree, so bending due to cell growth is almost nonexistent in the lower 90% of the trunk. Rings will form all around the trunks including between. If those trunks grow like 1/4 inch ring per year or 1/2 inch per year, then 100 years means 25 inches to 50 inches of wood growth expansion in every direction where there is not an obstacle. If opposing trunks both expand simutaneous, then the gap shrinks by 50 to 100 inches because it's doubled. But over several centuries, there's tens to hundreds of inches growing.

Even the wounds may close over given time. Some will and some won't. But take Stout Tree redwood for example. The trunk looked entire all the way around for decades. A few years ago, falling debris knocked some tissue off exposing a small "COIN SLOT" a little more. I put a light inside and there's a huge burned cylindrical hole up the middle, apparently from centuries ago. It closed over most of the way during who knows how many years of time. That was the tree the made me realize almost any giant redwood I see in the forest could have a big hollow.

Attached is Stout redwood. Best I can tell, it's a single. I'm adding these in regard to how burned cavities can disappear and become encased.
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Stout_Slot_2.jpg
Family_2_600.jpg
M. D. Vaden of Oregon = http://www.mdvaden.com

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mdvaden
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Re: General Sherman is NOT single stem origin. Hence, not th

Post by mdvaden » Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:55 pm

Here's another photo from this weekend, in Prairie Creek. The attached coast redwood shows asmall extra trunk emerged near the base and is somewhat distinct, then bonded to the larger trunk without a trace of bark inclusion above. I marked the upper area with arrows. The entire trunk may be from several. I marked another possible stem separation with a green arrow, but that line is very short and hard to tell one way or the other. The one with yellow lines is distinct. The upper trunk looks mostly single with almost no lines from bark inclusion, showing how some multi-trunk origin can't be found in the upper trunk.

I found the forest fascinating this weekend. Some trunks had trunks that bonded earlier in life it seemed. Other doubles or triples, pressed close but didn't seem to make the same union for whatever reason.
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A_Fuse_LR.jpg
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