Green Lakes State Park, New York

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bbeduhn
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by bbeduhn » Mon Jan 25, 2016 3:35 pm

That butternut is a co-champ with the Maxlist butternut. However, a taller one may have been found in the last several years.

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ElijahW
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by ElijahW » Sun Feb 21, 2016 12:52 am

NTS,

A few more updates and new trees to add to the Green Lakes list:

Tuliptree Cathedral

Bitternut hickory
139.8' x 8'8"

Sugar maple
131.6' x 6'3"

Northern red oak
122.2' x 11'5"

Outside Cathedral

White ash
136.7' x 10'6" (previously 131'; I believe this is the true top)

Eastern hemlock
133.8' x 9'3"
132.6' x 7'11"
131.3' x 8'5"

American basswood
133.0' x 7'9" (previously 132.1'; higher twig in same cluster as previous top)
124.5' x 7'11"

Sugar maple
126.2' x 6'9"
125.7' x 7'9"

Black cherry
120.3' x 8'5"
119.0' x 6'9"

I've found 7 hemlocks so far above 130', none of them competing with tuliptrees, and I expect there are a few more. Though only one basswood has broken 130', they make 120' regularly in old growth areas, and several are over 125'. The 131' sugar maple doesn't appear to be an old tree, and it is competing with tulips. I expect it will continue to grow at a good clip. Next year, Green Lakes may have two bitternuts over 140', one more than Zoar Valley. The Rucker Index for Green Lakes now stands at 131.6.

The old growth beyond the power line right of way is much more extensive than I previously thought, and will take some more time to work through. It's a really attractive sugar maple-beech-basswood forest, with many large, tall hemlocks. I look forward to returning soon.

Elijah
"There is nothing in the world to equal the forest as nature made it. The finest formal forest, the most magnificent artificially grown woods, cannot compare with the grandeur of primeval woodland." Bob Marshall, Recreational Limitations to Silviculture in the Adirondacks

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tomhoward
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by tomhoward » Sun Feb 21, 2016 2:14 pm

Elijah,

These are exceptional heights. The 131.6 ft. Sugar Maple is the tallest in NY as far as I know, beating the tallest tree in the Liverpool Maple Grove. The 133.8 ft. Hemlock and 133 ft. Basswood are also NY records. The 136.7 ft. White Ash is easily the tallest in central NY.

More surveys of Green Lakes are needed.

Tom Howard

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ElijahW
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by ElijahW » Sat Mar 19, 2016 2:27 pm

NTS,

Below are some photos from a morning visit to Green Lakes. I didn't measure any trees, as I'm waiting on a replacement for my damaged Nikon 440. I apologize with the lack of an object for scale; I planned to use a jacket, but had second thoughts about ticks crawling on it.
136' White ash
136' White ash
133' American basswood (curvy tree in center)
133' American basswood (curvy tree in center)
A pair of 130'+ Hemlocks
A pair of 130'+ Hemlocks
Large downed Sugar maple
Large downed Sugar maple
Second-tallest Hemlock found so far (133'+)
Second-tallest Hemlock found so far (133'+)
On my walk, I came across 3 or 4 more tall Basswoods; perhaps one will top 130'. I also saw a lot of Witch-hazel, one of which I would guess is around 40' tall. I haven't seen any around here approaching that height before - what does this species achieve further south?

Elijah
"There is nothing in the world to equal the forest as nature made it. The finest formal forest, the most magnificent artificially grown woods, cannot compare with the grandeur of primeval woodland." Bob Marshall, Recreational Limitations to Silviculture in the Adirondacks

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Will Blozan
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by Will Blozan » Sun Mar 20, 2016 10:11 am

Elijah,

53' is the tallest witch-hazel I know of. Jess Riddle probably has a taller one somewhere. 40' is pretty good though!

-Will

Joe

Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by Joe » Sun Mar 20, 2016 10:23 am

Will Blozan wrote:Elijah,

53' is the tallest witch-hazel I know of. Jess Riddle probably has a taller one somewhere. 40' is pretty good though!

-Will
Amazing- here in western Mass., I don't think I've ever seen it as more than a small bush- maybe 10' tall at best. Anyone know how big it can get in Mass.?
Joe

wisconsitom
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by wisconsitom » Mon Mar 21, 2016 2:06 pm

Hemlocks here in this part of NY are unaffected by HWA then? Good to know, if true.

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Erik Danielsen
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by Erik Danielsen » Mon Mar 21, 2016 9:41 pm

Tom, I wish that were the case. Here's the 2014 detection map: http://www.dec.ny.gov/images/lands_fore ... hwamap.jpg Since then, I can confirm HWA in Chautauqua County (the westernmost) as well. Winters with prolonged cold like those of 2013 and 2014 do seem to suppress the adelgid to some degree but don't do more than slow it down. In climates where the adelgid has a short season, afflicted trees can take many years to die, so the effects aren't immediately apparent. This warm past winter has probably been good for the adelgid, unfortunately.

wisconsitom
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by wisconsitom » Tue Mar 22, 2016 8:26 am

Awe man Erik, that sucks. I still dread the day we find an active outbreak here. It has been said-and I believe it-that with HWA wreaking so much havoc to our east, it is only in NE WI, Michigan's Upper Peninsula, and maybe a few other scattered areas, where hemlock remains largely free of this destructive pest. Sure, we're colder than all the states to our east many winters, but with the way climate's getting messed with, who knows? Right where my land is is an extremely rich hemlock area. It amazes me to see the new recruitment coming up in quite a few patches of woods. Deer up the gazoo too, so go figure. But that insect would make the deer issue recede into the background pretty quickly I think. Keeping my fingers, two toes, and my forearms crossed.

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Jess Riddle
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Re: Green Lakes State Park, New York

Post by Jess Riddle » Tue Mar 22, 2016 6:36 pm

Elijah,

The only witch-hazel I measured in NY was a 28' tree at Clark Reservation. I would call 40' tall anywhere. The 53' tree in the Smokies is still the record.

Jess

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